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20.3.2011

This review is going to be quite an undertaking because frankly, I don't even know where to start but I know it'll be overly long. Perhaps you should skip it if you don't like reading a lot of text haha. I suppose I should start by saying that Yakuza 3 was the title that initiated me into the franchise after hearing vague notions of its similarities to Shenmue. I loved the 3rd installment and almost everything about it. We had a great protagonist: sometimes stoic, honorable, calm under pressure, and really just completely bad ass! So when I heard that the narrative for Yakuza 4 was going to be split between 3 other heroes, I have to admit I had my reservations.This is one of the best video game purchases I've made in a while.I still can't decide which I like better, this or Yakuza 3. As soon as I started playing with Akiyama, I couldn't help but be reminded of some cross between Oh Dae-su from Oldboy and Spike Spiegel from Cowboy Bebop. I believe the moment I knew I was going to love the rest of the game was the cutscene when the appropriately stereotypical mob goons got really hot-headed with him and Akiyama stayed cool-headed and retorted with smug insults. I mean how much better can you get than that? Not only does it brings us into the world of that fantasy, but with main heroes that likable and charismatic, it made me want to see the whole story through with them.I'm just before the very final section of the game, and I can see how some of the reviews thought that Yakuza 4 had a ponderous quality to the story-telling. It didn't stop me from being engaged though. But the catalyst that makes it work so well, that makes me want to keep watching the story unfold from betrayals to reunions is the CHARACTERS and their RELATIONSHIPS. If I had to choose two things that marks the game's strength, those would be it. And those absolutely go hand in hand. The literal things that happen along the way probably wouldn't mean as much if all these people (including NPCs) had no real depth, life, or passions. Almost all the characters in this game have a personal meaningful struggle and I can't help but empathize with them. And in order to convey all that meaning, is the technical prowess portrayed throughout the in-game cut scenes. Correct me if I'm wrong, but for some reason, I don't remember the rendered faces in Yakuza 3 being as beautiful, subtle, and meticulous. I'm talking about the cut scenes with the voice acting, not the text boxes. Sega has really done something wonderful to surpass the uncanny valley. Our heroes are no longer just angry, or just happy, or just sad. There are many facial hints to their expressions that it's almost lifelike to me. The recognition of irony in Akiyama's face with a subtle smirk, the look of barely concealed savagery with Saejima. At some points, during some of the game's greatest revelations (pun intended), I was disappointed that when a character found out something extremely important, the game sometimes resorted to the text box sequences.Much of the story plays out in Japanese melodramatic fashion...and that's a good thing! It's a pity that we have this idea that melodrama is something not to be taken seriously due to its over-the-top nature. Just because something isn't merely slice-of-life doesn't take away from the truth of what characters do and feel within the construct of the fantastical, living, breathing world Yakuza 4 gives us. And truth is much greater than being real. Realness is a confined quality, where truth can span the entire spectrum of human experience. So when a character stays behind to buy time so that someone else can escape, confesses to a 25 year old sin, and yes, gets into a fist-fight for the sake of honor and life's duty, there is a clear, strong, and palpable reason why these characters do what they do. In that way, I couldn't help but think of many other great stories that we've been blessed with: Macbeth, Hamlet, Oedipus Rex, many Kurosawa films etc. It doesn't have to fit into our world because the world of Yakuza 4 is so expressive and vibrant that it can hold all those typically "melodramatic" things.Something else very striking to me is this "institutionalized sexism" I've been hearing about. I'm not talking about this to go on a moral rant or anything but some of it made me feel a bit uncomfortable. I don't remember feeling that way at all in Yakuza 3. In time, you'll have played through two mini-games: mini RPGs where you train young girls to be good hostesses and men to be fighters, respectively. In order to make a girl a good hostess, you have to dress them up appropriately, teach them social interaction, and cater to the club-goers' needs. It's like a rather insidious Barbie dress-up game. If you choose the option to allow them to go on a break, they talk on their cellphones like what one would think frivolous little girls would do. On the other hand, when you train a male fighter, you improve his strength, speed, and to an extent, assertiveness. The gender roles are very clear and yet it's the male NPCs in this game who usually come off very approval-seeking and lower in status while they pursue women like trophies. Let me just be clear: none of what I said is a criticism of the game, but I do think it's worth noting. Heck, western games have their own version of it, most likely to satirize it. The fact that this game calls out a real facet of Japanese culture is certainly a credit to it.The actual gameplay is not too different from the last installment. I get bored easily with fighting games (at least 1 vs. 1 style fighting games like Soul Calibre etc.) but I never get tired of beating the crap out of punks who talk a lot of smack. I suppose what makes it all the more exciting and satisfying, particularly with the boss fights, is that from a narrative standpoint, the bad guys usually have a low expectation of you despite how bad-ass you are. They keep talking as if they can easily kill you and easily outnumber you, and all that does is make me want to fight that much harder. As far as battles among the main players, there is always such a profound mutual respect between the "good" guys and the "bad" guys, that I can't help but admire their individual appeal. Sure, the main adversaries may be twisted by our standards, but it's because they have a vision of how they see their world filtered through their own sense of justice. No two dimensional typical Yakuza bad guys here except for the henchmen which is pretty appropriate. My favorite moments in the boss battles have to be the scripted HEAT action sequences. It's so interesting to me that through a couple of well-timed on-screen guided button presses a la Shenmue or Heavy Rain, it can make you so emotionally invested in the over-the-top drama of battle. When a great punch or kick connects because you happen to hit X at just the right moment, you can't help but feel responsible for it, especially the final battles.There's been a lot of debate regarding whether someone should start with earlier Yakuza titles if they're new to the series. In my opinion, Yakuza 4 is superior to Yakuza 3...but you should still start with Yakuza 3, or even earlier games. If I had a PS2 compatible system, I would be on those myself (except for the first one, I just can't imagine playing with dubbed English voices). The reason I say this is because much of the emotional pay-off that comes with Yakuza 4 is structured upon the journey you take with Kiryu in the earlier games. You have a greater appreciation for his struggles, as well as his relationships with the likes of Majima, Daigo, and particularly Hamazaki. Sure, for the sake of convenience there are recaps of the first three games and while I appreciate Sega putting those in for newcomers, I imagine it just wouldn't be the same as playing through Yakuza 1-3, or at least 3. When you finally get to the orphanage, you can't help but identify emotionally to what that place means for you considering that in Yakuza 3 you spend a lot of time there. I sort of equate it to watching a show like LOST starting from season 2 or 3. Yeah, I mean you can do it and have your friends recap the particulars of the first season, but it's just not the same satisfying feeling of going through so much history with familiar faces over the course of four games.That you only spend a fraction of the game playing as Kiryu shouldn't detract you from the game. If anything, it makes it all the more satisfying to reunite with him when you finally get to play as him. Anyway, I realize this is long and probably didn't talk about things in length such as gameplay, sound, etc. but you need to pick this game up. This is one of those games that I would probably tell people is more like an "experience" that you need to have. And when you finally beat this game, you get a trophy aptly called "Thank You". When game creators are gracious toward their fans (like MGS4, Uncharted 2, and now this), it really shows throughout the entire experience. I literally felt like I spent a whole week in bustling Tokyo (Kamurocho).-----I'm going to beat this game before I elaborate on some of the more technical points (which are all excellent, particularly the ambient sound and voice acting). I can't bring myself to beat it before I complete most of the sub-stories. I know there's a premium adventure once you beat the game but I know like the last one, I won't go back to it once the main story is finished.
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14.4.2011

Well, here we are with the latest entry in the most overbearingly macho crime thriller in gaming as Yakuza defies the odds to once again to see release outside Japan when not long ago it seemed all but certain Yakuza 2 was going to be the last entry in the series we'd ever get to play. This newest entry in the series has everything you'll have loved about Yakuza 3 and a lot more besides... but at the same time it actually fails to match up to it's predecessor in some respects.Taking place one year after the events of Yakuza 3, number 4 for once does NOT begin showing us what series protagonist Kazuma Kiryu has been up to since we last saw him, but instead starts with you in control of eccentric loan shark Akiyama,who has some unusual conditions attached to his money lending and his story begins when a mysterious woman called Lily shows up at his office asking to borrow 100 million Yen, which Akiyama agrees to if Lily fulfills a job he has for her... It's from there things follow the usual Yakuza path of wandering around Kamurocho carrying out sub quests and side stories in addition to following the main plot as you desire, with the usual batch of insanity and utterly brutal violence generously peppered throughout. However, this shift to a new character doesn't stop with Akiyama, for as the game progresses, you will control three other characters including death row prisoner Saejima, who you navigate through a Shawshank style prison break plot, and hotshot young cop Tanimura, whose seeming disinterest with his job masks a desire to find out who murdered his father. The last character I will not spoil for you, you'll enjoy it more that way. All characters with seemingly no connection to each other whose stories and pasts become closely tied together within a massive conspiracy involving mob civil war, high level police corruption and a desperate quest for revenge all tied to a Yakuza related mass murder in a restaurant decades before. It is a densely layered plot that takes in an enormous number of characters throughout to the point it can get slightly confusing. Yes, Kiryu does show up along the way as a supporting character in case you miss him, and yes, old faces like Haruka, Date, Majima and Daigo are back... but at the same time there is a large number of new characters, with each of the new playable characters coming with their own supporting casts and backstory. There is a LOT of information to take in here and it can get difficult to keep track of who is plotting what and so on, but taken as a whole, it's a mostly solid plot that manages to satisfyingly tie a LOT of seemingly disconnected threads together... even if there are some MASSIVE missteps in the plot getting there. Plus, some of the events that occur are so unbelievably OTT and flat out ridiculous it sometimes feels as if this game is trying to parody it's subject matter. Saying that, it isn't like the Yakuza series has ever been 100% serious about itself, and I'm probably being a bit stupid to complain about realism in a game series that has previously seen you have to fist fight a bull for one boss encounter and whose favourite 'go to' climactic scenes involve heavily tattooed middle aged men meeting up on the roof of tall buildings in the middle of the night to punch out their differences while screaming fortune cookie platitudes at each other. It is gloriously cheesy, ludicrously dumb madness.The gameplay is largely unchanged from Yakuza 3, there's just a lot more to do this time, plus there are four different characters to master, each one with their own completely unique fighting style, unique sub quests and side missions and areas around Kamurocho that only specific characters can access. These character specific versions of Kamurocho make for interesting playing, as you're forced to adapt how you play as you go due to each character's circumstances. For example, as one character is wanted by the police, you're forced to use side streets and alleys and even the sewers to sneak around the city to avoid police patrols and as another character IS a cop, you're often radioed to go to crime scenes or stopped by police patrols to help out with incidents that occur seemingly randomly like chasing a shoplifter, or taking down a hostage taker holed up in a building or searching an underground car park for hiding gang members. Sure, it mostly ends with you having to pound some guys to pulp, but the differences made to the game for each character you control makes for a nicely varied experience and provides a wealth of available sub missions and things to do. In addition, there are the usual mini games across each character's story like arcade games (Including a sequel to Yakuza 3's excellent 'Boxcelios' scrolling shooter), batting, cage fighting, UFO catcher, the requisite extensive number of gambling based games... a huge number of things to do here outside the main story, including the mini game a vocal minority whined about being removed from Yakuza 3 in the form of the "hostess clubs', where you can try to establish relationships with hostess girls in bars dating-sim style, or even have a go at being a PG pimp by running your own hostess bar, where you decide how your girls dress, wear their hair, how much make up they need and help them with their conversational skills... yeah, I can see how such an essential part of the game would have been sorely missed. As usual, much of the game revolves around chasing people down and beating them up, or fighting your way through small armies of thugs and gangsters using every bit of scenery not nailed down to do so etc etc... it's still a heavily combat focused game, but the combat is as solid as ever, but far more varied and user friendly this time, thanks to expanded move sets, additional player characters and a completely overhauled levelling system that is a huge improvement on the one used in all the previous games. Sadly, there has been some cutting down since Yakuza 3 into the bargain also. For one, you can no longer visit the city of Okinawa, which was a very large play area in Yakuza 3. It's been replaced by an expanded Kamurocho, with an added huge series of sewer tunnels to explore and underground homeless shanty towns to visit as well as the ability to explore the rooftops of Kamurocho. It adds much, but probably not as much as Okinawa did to the last game. Additionally, several mini games seem to have been removed that were in Yakuza 3. Whether the newer ones serve as adequate replacement is up to you.Technically, it's all much the same as Yakuza 3 again. The already impressively detailed facial models and animations look even more refined this time, which is just as well considering the amount of time you'll spend watching guys sitting around talking at length. Kamurocho is even bigger and more detailed than ever, with some impressive crowd work on display, even though the draw distance on the people/characters walking around is rather rubbish(Though oddly there are no scenery pop up or draw distance issues). The performance is rock solid though and I'd be remiss if I didn't mention how hilarious the facial deformation during fights is, with enemies getting black eyes, bruises, busted noses and lips and even having teeth fly out of their mouths and dislocated jaws hanging loosely off their face on occasion. It's so comically brutal it's hard not to find it funny. The soundwork is also strong, with a perfectly fitted(If mostly unremarkable) score topped up with infectious J-Pop tracks for the karaoke mini games. The voice acting is where the real meat is though... yes, it's once again in Japanese with subtitles, but the seemingly knowingly hammy, shouting filled dialogue and ridiculous over the top moralising speeches during inappropriate scenes coupled with the previously covered comically OTT violence and plot combine to make this game a masterclass in subtle parodying of macho romanticising gangster cinema. I just really hope that it's doing it deliberately, because I don't think I want to live in a world where someone might have been completely serious when they were writing this game's script.It's not a game without it's problems, though, pretty much all of them the same as Yakuza 3: Japanese voices only, which might make it more setting authentic, but will try the patience of many considering the cutscenes in this game are regular and some of them are LONG. The game has a huge mandatory install (5GB) as well, and there are a few too many instances of conversations being in stiff, text only format with no voicework at all, sometimes occurring at frankly inappropriate moments in my eyes and the lack of variety in available locations (Seeing as you're restricted almost entirely to Kamurocho this time, no Okinawa as mentioned) makes the whole game feel a tad more repetitive to me.This is still a very good game, offering a huge amount of gameplay content and replay incentives in addition to new(Though not nearly used enough) online leaderboard support and a rich variety of bonus modes, you can get many many hours out of Yakuza 4 if you get into it, but therein lies the problem... the series continues to have such a niche aim to it that this game is near impenetrable to newcomers coming in blind. Once again, this is NOT a game for everyone, so be very sure about what you're buying before trying to use Yakuza 4 to 'dip your toe in the water' so to speak.
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21.3.2011

I completed Yakuza 4 last night and it gave me a final statistics screen. It had took me 35 hours to complete the story, yet according to the completion statistics I had only completed 23% of the game. It's been a while since I've last played a game that has had me playing for half a day for a number of days. To clarify Yakuza 4 doesn't have a particularly long story. 10 of those 35 hours played were story. Half those 10 hours were cutscenes. What makes this game excellent are the distractions.We'll begin with a brief overview of the story. Like the previous game, Yakuza 4 has an option to watch a catch up of the events that happened in the first three games.If you're someone who wants to purchase this game but not have to play through the other games then Yakuza 4 has you covered. Although I would recommend you play the others first to get a proper understanding of the story. At the very least Yakuza 3 has the same option to watch the first two game's story. As for Yakuza 4's story it seems in my opinion better than Yakuza 3's story. What's new to Yakuza 4 is that you aren't controlling just Kiryu Kazuma but three other characters. I was a little sceptical on how this would work. The first character you play as is Shun Akiyama, a loan shark with a different way of lending money. Without interest and collateral, you just need to pass his little tests to gain the money. Quite possibly the most interesting new character in the game. Taiga Saejima: a hitman who killed 18 Yakuza on his own but was later caught. My initial expectations of Saejima from the trailers were low but I was amazed by his very interesting story. It caught me by surprise. Masayoshi Tanimura: a policeman with a gambling problem. Tanimura's story wasn't particularly interesting at first. His was the weakest of all the stories but nonetheless quite exciting at least until the end of his story. Finally you have Kiryu Kazuma, a former yakuza (the fourth chairman of the Tojo Clan too, that's apparently up at the top) who, like in the last game, manages an orphanage. I won't say anymore about the story because it's the strongest part of a Yakuza game. But it has plenty of twists and enough to keep you on the edge of your seat. It's worth mentioning like the last couple of Yakuza games that this game is in Japanese with English subtitles. If you aren't a fan of subs then this isn't the game for you.Next is the gameplay. Unlike other story-heavy games this game has plenty of gameplay. Lots of it. Like I said earlier it becomes a pleasant distraction. Players new to the Yakuza games may be confused how it all works. When I first played a Yakuza game I kept running towards the main missions because I thought there was a time limit to them. Gradually you learn that you can complete the main story in your own time. That is when you start to play ten pin bowling when you really should be saving a friend from death. Yakuza 4 has the added bonus of not being as heavily edited as Yakuza 3 was. Yakuza 4 only has two edits. One is a Japanese trivia game (which isn't a massive loss) and the opening video has different music than the Japanese release. All this means is Hostess Clubs make a return. If you play as Akiyama you can create a hostess and slowly bring her up to the top. Saejima however has a dojo training side mission where he trains fighters to win in fighting tournaments. Tanimura has a police scanner event where you can take down criminals for some extra cash. Playing as Kazuma allows you to fight new gangs in Kamurocho. With that mention of Kamurocho it's time to talk about the "city".Kamurocho is a district in Tokyo. A red light district at that. While it's the same old place we've been in for 4 games, it has been improved. There are more shops, more minigames and more restaurants. If you aren't completely happy with that there is also the ability to go on rooftops and underground. It's is annoying that we're in the same place again considering Yakuza 3 added a new map in Okinawa but at the same time us Yakuza veterans are so used to Kamurocho that we don't even need to use the map.As for any changes Yakuza 4 has made I have already said about the character specific minigames there's also the new levelling system. In the previous games you would have to fill an experience bar. To unlock new moves you'd have to fill that exp bar a number of times. It was a hard enough system to explain which is easier to understand in action. The new levelling system isn't too different. When you level up you gain soul orbs which you use to purchase new abilities. There aren't too many changes but they're more tweaks than overhauls. Everything that was in Yakuza 3 (save for the Okinawa map) is there in Yakuza 4. Revelations are still in it, bowling, golf, fishing and pool are still in the game. Put them altogether and you have a game that can last you at least a month.Graphics are the same as Yakuza 3. The cutscene graphics are astonishing but graphics outside cutscenes are just terrible. It's simply amazing how good the graphics can look in a real time cutscenes but fall short when you're just playing the game. This game is all about the immersion and you do seem to come back to reality when you see ol' low resolution textures man.It's difficult to talk about Yakuza 4 because of the huge amount of content in it. There's so much to talk about. You can't possibly go on to say every little feature this has without having a large wall of text. This game will keep me company for a long while even though I've completed the story. But I still have the hostess club missions to complete, I want to go fishing, I need to fight in a tournament, I want to play darts. All that and much more for me to do. I've only completed 23% of the game, I have another 77% to go and I'll enjoy every second of it.
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29.3.2011

STORYThe story is presented to us from four different perspectives. Firstly, there is Akiyama, a money lender with a very rough past. Next, we have Saejima, a yakuza member who committed a murderous crime 25 years ago, killing 18 members of the Ueno Seiwa clan. Saejima returns to Kamurocho to find the man who betrayed him all those years ago. Thirdly, we have Tanimura, a young cop who is tracking Saejima's case, which led to the death of his father. Last, but not least, we have Kazuma Kiryu, the legendary fourth chairman of the Tojo clan. Kazuma is handed a book which details a plot, endangering all Tojo clan members,and will intertwine with the actions of the three supporting protagonists.The four playable characters are wonderful in creation and their individual contributions to the overall story are nothing short of brilliant. Their stories successfully combine together and are just as intricately woven together. Sure, the events of the game don’t have much to do with the Sunshine orphanage, but the children are the heartbeat and motivation to what Kazuma does.GRAPHICS & SOUNDKamurocho will act as the primary map location so you’ll be walking these streets a majority of the time. The environments are varied; prison islands and isolated shipping yards are just some of the new destinations in store for you. With regards to map design, you can also access certain rooftops and use these as makeshift pathways around the city. There are also underground areas to be visited such as parking lots and sewers. if the regular public get on your nerves, then you are more than welcome to make acquaintance with the crazy homeless groups. Texture details have been given a boost, adding atmosphere to the night time environments, and allowing Kamurocho to come alive with its bright lights and large electronic displays.The cutscenes look excellent, presented with flair and flawless motion capture work. I personally loved the artistic snapshot before a boss fight, brush strokes and vivid colours whizz across the screen before an epic encounter. The characters feel so alive through their movement; they look natural as their facial expressions perfectly correlate to their dialogue.There can be inconsistency regarding character models; this doesn’t apply to the main story protagonists.I love the details of characters bleeding when they get hit, but I feel more could have done with the damage modelling. The soundtrack struggles to make its presence known and unfortunately fades away into the background. Perhaps I’m being harsh in regards to the soundtrack, as some of the music during combat works wonderfully well.GAMEPLAYThe gameplay remains fairly similar since the previous game. However, this time you have the four different protagonists to control, each of them with their own fighting styles. I was always given the impression that taking the story away from Kazuma would be a bad idea, now I can appreciate that this design choice was implemented to serve the gameplay and keep it fresh. Akiyama has fantastic kicking techniques, Saejima is a mean brawler, Tanimura uses submission moves, and Kazuma needs no introduction as to what he can do. There are plenty of new moves to discover, whether you level up or complete sub-stories/side missions.On the subject of combat, it feels much more responsive this time around, the control is smooth and won‘t want to make you pull your hair out. There are still loads of context sensitive moments during battles, these can pop up at anytime so it’s wise to be on your toes. Some of the finishing moves are truly amazing, charge your heat level up and spectacularly dispatch your foes. The enemies confront you in large groups; they use a variety of weapons and attempt to surround you much quicker. There are plenty of weapons to pick up and upgrade, though you could just as easily complete the game without buying any weapons whatsoever. The chase sequences have also been improved; an ability to dash has also been implemented to get around those tight corners.Yakuza 4 is an open world game, feel free to take a break from story missions and spread your wings. During Akiyama’s story section, he actually owns hostess clubs so you can choose what makeup the girls wear, their clothing, jewellery etc. Each of the remaining characters has a particular sub-story very similar to Akiyama’s hostess challenge. Aside from the female endeavours, you can slug some baseballs at the practice nets, go bowling, play table tennis or go to the local hot springs and relax. I’ve mentioned a handful of activities; there is simply so much to do.The camera still has some issues and can feel very sluggish when turning and when walking down narrow gaps. I can’t hide my disappointment about the boss fights, many are forgettable and don‘t represent mighty clashes.O V E R A L LEvery character contributes so powerfully to the overall story, it didn’t make me think that I’d rather have more emphasis placed on Kazuma instead. The game engine remains largely unchanged, but I’ll happily sacrifice that for a compelling plot. I‘m amazed how Sega has juggled multiple characters at once, yet they have developed them all so well.
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9.6.2012

This game really is not for everyone and I can understand its low sales BUT having never played the previous games Yakuza 4 has turned me into a fan. By now most people will know you get to play as 4 characters (with different fighting styles) who meet up in the finale of the story. What I liked most was how the story was developed. At first it seemed a simple dull let's stop these guys but then that all changed when I started playing as Taiga Saejima, a man who has been imprisoned for 25 years and finds out that he wasted his life in prison for what I cannot explain without spoiling the story. All I can say is it's not as simple as it first appears and that is the part that gripped me most.There is no way I can talk about the story without giving away spoilers so all I can say is it builds over time and you begin to see it from the 4 different perspectives of the characters who come together for the final fight. It does seem a little bit like Avengers but done in a more serious way that could be closer related to mafia movies.Now the make or break part of the game.The cutscenes make it for many but also break it for others. For me I found them very interesting and enjoyable with some great acting from all the characters. One scene involved a Yakuza singing in a hostess bar and goes mad when your character turns the music off which ends in a brawl, while another scene you will see the character's friend kill someone and wonder why they did it. You really feel that everything in the main story is done for a reason and the results of such actions have on each of the characters. The problem with the cutscenes is that they can be very very long. I'm talking 5-10minutes of a cutscene which is why it will annoy some people as games such as RDR, GTA give you quick 2-3 minute cutscenes. The next problem for many is that it is in Japanese and Chinese language so you will have to rely on subtitles to understand what the characters are saying so if a cutscene came on you have to fully focus on the game by yourself rather than letting someone interrupt you. (Also do not skip cutscenes as they are all important even if they are long)Also after the cutscenes you will get chunks of in game text boxes which ruin such great cutscenes. I hope they get rid or reduce the amount if they create another game. I've watched many and enjoyed old Chinese films where they don't speak English and films such as "Crouching tiger, hidden dragon" so subtitles don't bother me as much as some others.In terms of the graphics and presentation you can see it is very dated and not even close to the likes of games such as Uncharted but graphics don't make a game, it's more about the gameplay and story which this game has.It has a lot of content but keeping it brief, instead of quickly killing someone with a gun these guys prefer to beat their enemies to death in the most violent, animalistic and comedic ways I have seen. It's like a cross between, Tekken, Dragonball z and using triangle like it's your best friend. One part of the game I almost felt sorry for my enemies as I was in a room fall of weapons while controlling Kiryu Kazuma and all I can say is being shot to death would be a nicer way to die. I always felt disappointed when I had less than 10 enemies attacking me as I didn't want the fighting to stop. The quick time events just add to the intensity of the fights as I had to protect myself from someone trying to kill me with a chainsaw. It's not all fighting thou as it would get tedious. You can also chase people, solve clues, play table tennis, bowling, get drunk, gamble, go to hostess bars etc etc etc it's just so much that I cannot mention them all and despite completing the main story after 20hours of play I've only completed 10% of total content. Another thing that I enjoyed most was the revelations. These were small quick time events where you would see some comedic situations where your character can learn moves from.I can't really add more other then to say its story element is the strongest point of the game but because it is not in English it will put many off but I still suggest giving it a try because if it was in English we would be hearing about this game a lot more. SEGA do need to cut out the constant text, reduce the cutscene length, improve the graphics and reduce the amount of random street fights or at least make them more challenging but still the game is great and very underrated. There may be many open world games that perform better than this such as Assassins Creed and Batman AC but it still provides you with 20-30 hours of content, interesting mafia style story and incredible brutality so you can't complain about that.
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17.3.2013

To describe a story, a song, or a game as being melodramatic is frequently to condemn the title in question and imply that it is shot through with strains of mawkish sentimentality and lacking in the finer distinctions of better works. Yet there is a place for melodrama, it is a perfectly legitimate narrative form and one which, when done right, can be as moving, well made and memorable as anything else. And that is a good description of Yakuza 4. Indeed, from a narrative standpoint, it encapsulates the whole of the franchise. Yakuza has been an on-going melodrama and this, the 4th entry in the main series, is the high point so far.When Yakuza 3 came out in 2010 it was a vast step forward for the series in both game-play and story telling.The fully voiced animated cut-scenes, the vast array of side missions, the excellence of the fighting system (which might be the best brawler the PS3 has seen) and, above all, the way in which the threats and stakes to the peace and security of the protagonist's (Kazuma Kiryu) orphan charges is raised from chapter to chapter was enthralling, compelling and delightful. If that game had one major flaw, however, it was that it felt, in some ways, rather like a side story when following on from the events of Yakuza's 1 and 2. So, when Sega brought out Yakuza 4 not long afterwards, using a great deal of the same animation and architecture, rather than seeming like a let down, it seemed far more as if the producers and writers had got the series back on track. Don't get me wrong, Yakuza 3 is an excellent game. It's gorgeous to look at (the colours in beach scenes in Okinawa are jaw droppingly lovely) exciting and fun to play, yet it did feel only tentatively connected to the preceding games. In 4 we had a game which had all these improvements and yet with a story which felt like a much more natural successor to the events of Yakuza's 1 and 2.Added to this Sega introduced another element which has given a much needed lease of life to the series: multiple protagonists. Meeting, getting to know and learning the fighting styles of the three new player characters gives Yakuza 4 a fantastic freshness. Yes, I could see how some players, being deeply attached to Kazuma, might call foul on this, but I wasn't one of them. Each of the three new comers had something to them, both as well written characters and as differential fighting styles, which made them a thoroughly enjoyable additions to the series. Whether it was laughing at the the laid back humour of Akiyama, or coming to sympathise with bone deep pain of Taiga Saejima, or being pulled into the depth of the mystery which is the life of Tanimura, they're all excellent foils for The Dragon of Dojima. Equally, learning and coming to terms with (two different things) their fighting styles was both fascinating and fun. After playing Kazuma for eighty hours straight in 3 it was a rather unsettling experience to have to get a feel for the timing and styles of each of the others. It was even unnerving, but unnerving in a good way. Clearly Kazuma, once leveled up, is a near god like fighter, so having to make the most of the ponderous strength of Taiga, or the panoply of holds and throws which make up Tanimura's arsenal definitely kept me engaged. Of the three new comers I felt that Akiyama was the least interesting fighter, but the bite and humour of his dialogue more than made up for that.Yakuza 4 is, without any doubt in my mind, a brilliant and compelling melodrama in game form. The game itself is excellent, both as an open world brawler and a thoroughly evocative Japan simulator. The graphics are a trifle dated, it's not a major issue but you can easily tell that what we're looking at is four, maybe five years behind the curve for a PS3 release. It really doesn't matter though as the art style more than makes up for the sub-part technical graphics. When you add great music, superb surround sound and stellar voice acting (God's above Takaya Kuroda's Kazuma Kiryu is astonishing) the over all production values in this game are just stellar. There are only a few reasons for not playing Yakuza 4, but, if you own a PS3, if you aren't someone who loathes Japanese culture, and you don't detest open world gaming, then do yourself a favour and buy a copy of Y4, you're in for a treat.P.S. The game is worth the playing just to get to the epic coolness of the introduction to the final fight sequence. Trust me, it will have you laughing out loud in sheer delight.
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3.7.2011

Being a bit of a Tokyo-phile following an amazing trip there back in the day and also a hard-core Tekken fan, it was only a matter of time before I picked this one up and I'm glad I did. Being a noob to the series and RPG's in general, it did take me a while to get into but after a few hours the story had sucked me in and there was no escape.Based almost entirely in, above and underneath Kamurocho a "lively" part of the capital you play as four different characters (moneylender, two ex-yakuza and a semi-bent cop) who are embroiled in a deep and dark tale of clan war, police corruption and double-crosses dating back to a legendary multiple hit 25 years ago. Being honest,it did get a bit confusing at times and I had to concentrate on the cut-scenes to stay with it but it was well worth the effort as the storyline is the key to this game's success. Ditto the playable characters, all different and all with a talent for immense violence but very likeable and you will enjoy time spent with each and the way their paths finally cross at the end.As mentioned, the story is excellent with some feature length cut-scenes so be prepared to down your controller and sit back and enjoy for over ten minutes at a time before you next get to grips with badasses on the streets. It's not a game to pick up for a quick session as the storyline can be unforgiving as far as save points are concerned - you have been warned. That aside, the gameplay (ok, the fighting) is excellent, think Tekken but with the added bonus of weapons such as swords, bicycles, street signs, 9-irons - anything you can find nearby or buy from a shady dealer (or relieve your opponent of). Unarmed combat is just as good with some great "heat" moves adding to the variety and general nastiness of the "finish" (it deserves it's 18 rating, let's put it this way). Your four characters each have a distinctive style - Akiyama being my favourite with his lightning combos but Saejima is also great fun to play with his bull-like charges and immense strength allowing him to swing anything including bodies and even motorcycles as he cracks head with aplomb. The fighting is easy to get into but with new moves added as you progress, button-mashers and experts alike will enjoy the action.The town is big but not too much so and after a while you can find your way around (take a taxi if you're feeling lazy) and new places to visit become available adding to the variety. The map could have been better but this adds to the challenge I guess - it's quite easy to toggle off the mini-map by hitting L3 accidentally so I discovered. The learning curve is not unduly steep (ok I played it on easy!) but you do need to prepare yourself by levelling and stocking up, particularly when playing as Tanimura in the finale. Fighting aside, there are more than enough adventures and experiences to have such as flirting in the hostess bars, bowling, pervy table tennis (classic), getting a massage, having some noodles and just generally enjoying yourself. It's not all about dishing out knuckle sandwiches to yakuza in offensive knitwear, it's about being an inhabitant of Tokyo and sampling the street life there too. If this is what RPG'ing is all about then count me in. The game really does capture the atmosphere, variety and downright quirkiness of the Japanese capital and it's population.This really is a time-eater and you can log off after a couple of hours after having achieved very little but having enjoyed every minute. I've just completed the main storyline, but there are still about 40-odd sub-stories plus mini-games and challenges for the hard-core and trophy hunters to complete. Perhaps I'll take it easy and buy Hiyori in club Elise a drink first, after all I've earned it :o)I regret coming late to this series and noobs like me may want to pick up the other titles or view all the cut scenes first (you get a bronze for doing so) but it's not essential. As others have said, it's certainly not for everyone but forget the dullest ever PS3 game cover, this is one thoroughly classy act.
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27.3.2011

Yakuza 4 (Ryu Ga Gotoku 4) was released in Japan last year when we received Yakuza 3. Sega has done a tremendous job in localising Yakuza 4, everything that was missing in Yakuza 3 (hostess bars) is back in Yakuza 4. The only thing cut from Yakuza 4 is the AnswerxAnswer quiz mini game and the Japanese Intro with the song called 'Butterfly City' (licence).In Yakuza 4 you play as four main characters, 3 new characters along with the 'Dragon of Dojima' Kiryu Kazuma. Shun Akiyama, the 'Lifeline of Kamurocho' who is a money-lender/loan shark. Taiga Saejima, a fugitive on death row who killed 18 men back in '85. And Masayoshi Tanimura the 'Parasite of Kamurocho', who is a cop that delivers his own brand of 'Justice'.Each character has a different fighting style, Akiyama is fast, Saejima is a powerhouse but slow, Tanimura relies on parries and technique and Kiryu is balanced (well he has been the main protagonist throughout the series, Yakuza fans know what techniques Kiryu has).The story is the most important aspect of the Yakuza games. The story is much more darker than the Yakuza 3 storyline. If you did not like the Orphanage part of Yakuza 3 then you will probably like the starting in Yakuza 4 (although it is confusing). It doesn't have much emotional parts like Yakuza 3 did but there is a few heart warming scenes in the game. The storyline will probably take you around 25 hours or more to complete depending on what you are doing for example playing the mini games and doing a few sub-stories.The leveling system has changed and is different compared to Yakuza 3. When your character levels up, the health and heat meter automatically upgrades but you get ability points, which you can spend on learning new moves for your character. The highest/maximum level for every character is level 20. You can also learn new moves by the returning revelations from Yakuza 3 (and Kenzan) and IF7-R which looks like a saiyan pod from Dragonball Z (IF7 was in Yakuza 3).The mini games are back and better than ever. You can get easily distracted from the story by playing the mini games in Yakuza 4. You can play pool, bowling, table tennis (new), golf, gamble, fishing and more. There is online leaderboards for this game, you can check what rank you are with each mini game (I'm not sure if it's region or world wide ranks). You can create your own hostess with Akiyama, train a rookie fighter with Saejima (Hideo Kojima reference), stop criminals and resolve problems with the police scanner with Tanimura, or take on gang members with Kiryu.The only issues I have with this game is dialogue, graphics and the map. The dialogue can annoy you if you just want to get on with the story (non playable characters mostly interrupt). The graphics have slightly been upgraded, but you get the same annoying graphical issues that were in Yakuza 3. Kamurocho is the main setting in each Yakuza game. In Yakuza 4, Kamurocho is the only setting (No Okinawa from Yakuza 3) but you get a underground mall, sewers, parking lot, docks and rooftops. I just knew most of Kamurocho from the back of my hand (because I played Yakuza 3 a lot).Get this game if you are into Japanese games, especially if you are into RPGs. You get a good story, likable/ dislikeable characters and mini games plus sub-stories to distract you. The game is worth the money as you can probably put in around 100 hours into getting 100% overall (not including platinum trophy, you probably get a platinum trophy before attempting 100% overall in the game like Yakuza 3).
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30.4.2011

The Yakuza games appeal to a very particular audience. None of the them really push the boundries of graphics and the sandbox-ish worlds they present feel very contained when compared to GTA or Saints Row. What the Yakuza games DO excel at (sometimes more so than their american counterparts) is style, character developement and adreneline-fueled hand-to-hand combat. Yakuza 4 is easily (in my opinion) the best of the series and manages to polish it's gameplay up a bit while adding a few new elements to make it stand on it's own.The story of Yakuza 4 is soap-opera/crime-thriller that involves a mysterious woman named Lili whose connected to a series of deaths in Tokyo's Red Lights district.As with previous installments, this game is very cut-scene heavy with lots of (well-acted) dialogue which can test your patience. The cut-scenes are a lot more engaging (with a lot more action!), this time around though and I didn't feel quite as bored as I did in Yakuza 3. Just as long as cut-scenes are the blocks of text you have to click through to move that action forward. Again, it's much better paced than the previous games but still a bit annoying.The biggest difference between Yakuza 4 and it's predecessors is the main character (or characters). Series protagonist Kazuma Kiryu is now one of FOUR controllable characters and he's only playable towards the end. Being a series fan I was a bit disappointed with this change as I'd gotten pretty attatched to Kaz, but that opinion quickly changed when first protagonist Shun Akiyama is introduced. Not only is this loan-shark (along with the corrupt cop Tanimura and convict Taiga Saejima ) just as fun to play as Kaz, I was actually MORE vested in these new characters than our usual hero and didn't WANT to stop playing them. Luckly by the end of the game their stories come together and you can switch between them at will.The graphics and the Yakuza games have never been their strong suit. The cut-scenes obviously look fantastic as do the main character models but the in-game environments still look like early PS3/late-PS2 graphics. There's still a lot of animations and colors in buildings and other structures and there's always a varied amount of people walking around which add to the game's immersion.The gameplay, despite some slow-down is better than ever in Yakuza 4! As usual combat takes place in these enclosed arenas where you're forced to beat up a group of enemies. Each main character controls perfectly and responsively with each bone-crunching punch/kick/throw being felt. The hostess clubs are back (and even work into a main character's narrative) as is mahjong, gambling, karaoke, erotic massages etc. There is so much to do in this game world that really adds to the flavor of being in Japan and really makes Yakuza 4 so much fun to play.I could go on and on about the things I love about Yakuza 4. It isn't perfect and like the other Yakuza games is an aquired taste. However, if you loved the previous enstallments as much as I do or are looking for a great noir-thriller game with a japanese twist definitely give Yakuza 4 a shot!(a note: I realise this is the fourth game in the series but newbies shouldn't worry about starting from the first game. This story stands very well on it's own and only somewhat ties into the previous game)
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19.3.2011

This review has been written after around 13 hours play...I have never played any Yakuza games before and got it mainly because I wanted to get my teeth into something 'open world' and time consuming. After the massive disappointment of Dragon Age 2, I heard some good things about this series so decided to take the plunge.The game is kind of a cross between GTA IV and Street Fighter (or any other kung-fu type fighty games). There is a gripping storyline in which you play four different characters (although after 13 hours I am still on the first character) all based in a fictional district which I assume is supposed to be in somewhere like Tokyo.I'll not go into the plot as you can read that for yourself in the game description.Basically the game revolves around a main plot with various sub-plots of which there are many. These sub plots go from the usual 'go and see this man and complete a task for him' to the bizarre 'dress and make-up a hostess in a hostess club'. It is such a strange mix, which I for one am not used to, that it is keeping me intruiged as to what I might be asked to do next!The figting is implemented quite well, with punches/kicks and various combos - of which you can learn more of as you level up. There are also weapons you can purchase or manufacture. You can make weapons by optaining 'recipies' and the correct ingredients ehich you find lying around. All I will say is that the combos are a bit much for my 40 year old fingers, so I end up just mashing the buttons until stuff dies. The more dextrous amongst you will probably cope better. Unlike other games like this, it doesn't seem to spoil the combat at all and I never feel like I am totally out of control.This being a Japanese game, there is lots and lots of dialogue interspersed with acted cut scenes. Normally I would get a litte bored of so much dialogue, but the storyline is so good that so far I have kept on reading and listening. The cut scenes are also very well done and although the voices are entirely in Japanese (with sub titles), they seem very well acted and add to the atmosphere immensely.Overall I am thoroughly enjoying the game so far. It is different from anything else of the genre and has enough surprises to remain fresh. The story is well written and well executed. The characterisations are good and I find myself wanting to know more about them and what happens to them - if it were a book I would probably have read it to the end by now.Note, although I have compared it to GTA - there is no driving in this game - you walk everywhere. The district is a lot smaller than the other games but is just big enough to be interesting - I am not sure if any other areas unlock with the other characters.Anyway, if you are looking for something a bit different in the vein of the Grand Theft Auto/Mafia type games then this may be for you. I am liking it a lot so far!
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1.3.2012

I bought Yakuza 3 on a whim a couple of years ago and enjoyed it, just never finished it. I was thrown off by the heavy Japanese focus and subtitles but for what parts I played I enjoyed them. So when I heard about Yakuza 4 coming out I decided to give the series another shot and pre-ordered it to see if the series was worth a second shot. Spoiler alert...I was amazed.Yakuza 4 is now one of my favorite games and I've got another copy on order so I can play through it again. The gameplay is great with a lot of brutal fights and the Tokyo setting is bright and vibrant with a metric ton of side activities (ordering a shot of Jack at an Irish themed pub FTW),but what won me was the characters and the story.If you told me to explain the plot at work in Yakuza 4 I would need a chalkboard and several hours to map out all the back-handed deals, betrayals, back from the deads and side changes because it is hella complicated. But the overall package is actually secondary to all the individual moments that make up the game. A gunfight in a ramen shop, a standoff on a skyscraper, a reunion of old friends, and a waterside duel around halfway through that is so insanely cool and beautiful I can't bring myself to spoil by telling who it involves. The cutscenes and dialogue are so full of emotion and power that you'll find yourself being drawn in just as if it were a movie. And even though you may struggle to keep up with all the goings on you'll have a hell of a time seeing it all unfold. If more games took time to create cutscenes such as the ones in Yakuza 4 video games would be considered a form of high art.Then there are the characters. The four that you play as (each has a chapter, coming together in the end ala Pulp Fiction) are great and really likeable in their own ways. You get to step into the shoes of not only series mainstay Kazuma Kiryu, but also Shun Akiyama (a shady loan shark), Taiga Saijima (a death row inmate) and Masayoshi Tanimura (a corrupt young police officer). Everyone knows Kaz but the other three all start out very morally ambiguous, but develop and show unexpected motives that make you really connect with them, particularly Saijima, who is now one of my favorite video game characters.Overall Yakuza 4 is a great game with a fantastic story element, great characters, fun gameplay and a beefy list of content to pursue. The developers at SEGA should deserve more attention for this series, and it really is a shame that it has to play second fiddle to FPS clones and glitchy RPGs. Yakuza 4 is a fun time, plain and simple.
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2.1.2012

I adore the Yakuza series, having played 1-3. Naturally, I had expectations coming into this game and I can say they were mostly fulfilled.Yakuza 4, much like the previous titles in the series, is a "beat-em-up" game similar to Final Fight from the arcade days. But it's mixed in with RPG elements such as random encounters and leveling up one's character (although, a bit simplistic). Where this game tries to breathe in some fresh air into the series is giving control of four separate characters instead of just the titular hero, Kazama Kiryu. Initially, I thought of it to be a welcome change but as the story progressed, I missed the story revolving around Kiryu. Not to say that the story is bad.Yakuza 4's story,again, like it's predecessors, can be described as a compelling crime drama. I'll admit that the story for Yakuza 4 had me more confused at various points than I had ever been in the previous titles. But, I was still compelled to proceed further to hopefully elucidate the questions I was having. By the time I reached the end, I was much satisfied with the story and most of my questions had been answered.Where the line will be drawn is the actual gameplay in Yakuza 4. It is afterall a video game, and if it isn't fun to play, there isn't any point to it at all. As I've stated before, I'm coming in with a bias. I have played the previous games and enjoy the exploration, beat-em-up, and level up gameplay. Some people may find it tiring, repetitive, or just plain boring. I'll admit, there was point about 3/4 the way through the game where I was kind of just going through the motions of the combat just to push the story along further. If it's innovation and riveting game play you're looking for, it might be best to pass over this one.The story may not be for everyone either. This is a Japanese game localized for the Western market. Thank goodness Sega has continued to bring this game stateside even though the audience for this type of game is extremely limited. It's based around Japanese characters in a Japanese culture; Japanese gang culture at that. Some people, understandably just won't "get it" or find it interesting.To sum it up, if you're a fan of the previous Yakuza games, then of course you should get this one. If beat-em-ups are fun for you, along with RPG style character management, this might be good for you as well. I think the story's great, but if you have no interest in reading subtitles or can't wrap your head around some Japanese nuances, maybe take a pass on this one.
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3.9.2012

I purchased Yakuza 4 at a late date, coming onto the title series from a friend recommendation. £15 for yak4 and I can only say - what a bargain. Really good fun, quite violent in a cartoony way, something I feel lacks these days from games, but heaps of new moves to earn and perfect. Great extras about the game that I didn't expect; you can go to bars to get drunk to keep your special up, you can go to hostess and dancing clubs (quite amusing to say the least - gotta love the Japanese influence), you can beat people with most objects around you, the games not too large so it doesn't take forever to get to the next mission, & it keeps going for AGES. For such a simple, classic style of game (item collection,mission points scoring, weapons upgrading, classic sorta thing), there are so many sub-stories and extra little side games, from baseball net training, snooker, darts, golf, fishing, bowling, arcades, betting & gambling, fighting tournaments... The list is endless. There's tons to do, lots of trophies to get and lots of power ups to achieve.Sleeping Dogs came out about a month after I purchased this, and I was still trying to finish off yak4 before starting SD. Now don't get me wrong here, SD is a good game, but it's nothing of what its predecessor was. Ok the gfx are better, the fight engines different, the free-roam is more extensive, but does this make for a better all round game? I don't think so. I had it finished in about a week, and now I am back onto Yakuza 4 and loving it - still. SD got boring, the maps too big, the journeys are long, and the worst part? You can't even go into a bar to get a drink, or watch the massage you just paid $5000 for! Lol.. Silly but it's the little touches that matter (no pun intended haha). And its too repetitive with regard to the missions... and the story is pants.For me, Yak4 is hands down the best title in the series, and for £15, how can you seriously go wrong? Great story, hours of laughs, giggles, fights and mild jovial perversion. Now that's what a game should be about :D
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4.11.2017

I am such a massive fan of this series. The cityscapes are so immersive and atmospheric, it makes you feel like you're really in Japan. Sadly, it is only recently with Yakuza 0 that the series has started to get the respect it deserves in the west, since people wrongly assumed the original was trying to compete with games like GTA: San Andreas. In reality, Yakuza is and always has been a JRPG dressed up as a brawler game.So what of this game? Well as soon as I put the disc in, I was impressed. I really liked the theme song to this game. This is the first game in the series to feature multiple playable characters. However, it is the only game since the first one (excluding Dead Souls and Kiwami,since that's just a remake of the first game) not to feature multiple city locations as part of the open world gameplay. The characters each have their own particular fighting abilities, which certainly does make for more interesting gameplay, given that this is what this game is all about. Also, they made up for the lack of multiple cities by increasing the depth of Kamurocho itself. This game gives you the ability to explore the district's sewer network and underground car parks, as well as run around on rooftops, although if you're expecting Mirror's Edge/Assassin's Creed style parkour, then you're in for a big disappointment. When I talked about this game being a JRPG, they've added even more of that into this game by giving you the ability to "craft" new weapons and armour using parts you can buy, find, win or get given from completing side stories.In terms of the story, it's not the best of the series, but that's a relative term. It's still a really enjoyable story that will keep you guessing until the end. As with most Japanese games though, the cutscenes can be lengthy, with a lot of subtitles to read. There is also a very questionable scene involving one of the playable characters, Taiga Saejima, which may leave you questioning how to feel about him as a protagonist. But other than that, it's good.
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26.11.2012

no turn based battles, no whiney emo teenagers, and no spiky hair.while most JRPG's are content to simply be set in a fantasy land, yakuza breaks the mold as it is set in modern day japan. Yakuza is a great JRPG that avoids typical JRPG tropes like its the plague, as well as being realistic. set in the red light district of japan (i believe its somewhere in shinjuku or is shinjuku just renamed) called kamurocho, where yakuza reign and the police are corrupt. if you haven't played the first three you should leave this page now and buy them now before you even think about purchasing this game. Yakuza has a lot of content packed in the small town you explore,so much content it may take you several play throughs to experience it all, i have played every yakuza game several time over and i'm STILL finding lots of goodies to enjoy. this is a game that you want to take you time and simply enjoy. the only problem a lot of player will have is the sheer amount of cut scenes, although well done, it can take away from the experience because they tend to drag on for obscene amounts of time. if you thought the amount of cut scenes in MGS4 was ridiculous, this game will put you off. another thing is the fact that each game is set in the exact same place so it can feel a little old after a while, but that isn't necessarily a bad thing. the money and time saved on world building is given to create new areas, like the roof tops and underground areas of yakuza 4, as well as new mini games, side quests and new small details added to the environments themselves. but if you can over look the flaws, you will find a great game that has a very rich and gratifying experience, on par with the likes of skyrim, it may not be as long or as deep as skyrim, but it is certainly the JRPG equivalent to the experience that skyrim provides while being decidedly japanese at the same time.
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